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PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2011 12:16 pm 
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Hi All,

A few months ago I have moved to a new home. It came with a room outside the house that was perfect for a fishhouse :) so that is where I keep my old tanks now. In the living room I am working on a new tank at the moment.

In this tank I would like to keep a group of wild Pt. Altum. I don't have them yet. Will get them as soon as the set up has been finished, which will take some time still. The tank is 3 meters long, 80 cm deep, and 70cm waterhight. This would be about 118x31.5x27.5 inches.

I would like to create a Pt. Altum biotope, but the question is which fish are suitable for keeping with P. Altum. On underwater video's shot in the wild you see for exemple Nanostomus Nanostomus and Leporinus sp. swimming with Altum. But will this work in a tank. It is not a small tank, but still considerably smaller than a river :D

Also all other suggestions for biotope correct tankmates are more than welcome.

Thanks!

Joost

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Video's of my Pt. Altum, Pt. sp. Santa Isabel and Pt. Sp. Rio Nanay:
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_q ... type=&aq=f


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2011 6:20 pm 
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Uaru fernandezyepezi :)

Based on Heiko Bleher's DiscusBook01, others include Leporinus sp, Crenicichla cf. notphalthalmus, Satanoperca daemon.

I keep other fish from the Orinocco basin too, but not sure if they're found specifically in Altum waters. Other fish I keep with my altums include L52 Dekeyseria sp., Geophagus winemilleri, Satanoperca mapiritensis and Mesonauta insignis.

Dithers that may end up as prey include Hemigrammus rhodostomus, Paracheirodon axelrodi and Hyphessobrycon sweglesi.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:22 am 
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Based on Heiko's Altum biotope video:

Mesonauta insignis
Leporinus agassizii
Leporinus klausewitzi
Chalceus macrolepidotus
Heros species
Laemolyta taeniata
Anostomus anostomus
Crenicichla wallacii
Moenkhausia collettii


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:47 am 
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Thnx :)

I don't have Heiko's book, but I do have the video that James speaks of.

Knowing which fish are found with P. Altum is one thing, but for me the greater challenge is to create a balanced stocking for my tank. I have got a fairly large tank, but it is not even close to the size of the Orinoco River or Inirida, Atabapo etc. :D

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Video's of my Pt. Altum, Pt. sp. Santa Isabel and Pt. Sp. Rio Nanay:
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_q ... type=&aq=f


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 12:11 pm 
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Joost, do you remember this:

http://www.finarama.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=3448#3448

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God listens. He may not always give you everything you want, when you want it; but he always gives you what you really need, when you need it most!
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2011 12:25 pm 
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And here was Ivan Mijolvij's reply back then:

"Hi everyone, for sure I can tell you exactly what fish live with the Orinoco altums. This doesn’t mean they are completely compatible with them but in the wild this is how it goes.

Corrydoras concolor
Apisto. Irinidae
Mylasoma rubipinnis
Cheriodon acelrodi
Amoncryptocharax elegans
Hemiodus orthnops , inmaculatus
Geophagus jurupari
Cichla temensis
Cichla orinocensis
L – 128 pleco
L – 200 pleco
L – 201 pleco
L – 124 pleco
L – 199 pleco
Paraotocinclus hepleyi
Heros severus
Mesonauta insignis
Dicrossus filamentosus
Crenicichla geayi, C. lugrubis
Cheirodon simulans,
Hypselecara coryphanoides
Motoro rays
Hoplarchus psittacus green
Achirus lineatus


And though Ivan's list is pretty complete, illuminae's suggestion of U. fernandezyepezi and also, S. daemon, Guainacara sp, Biotodoma wavrini, flagtails (prochilodus sp.) and there many others I have seen.

But certainly, in an aquarium, many of these species will not be compatible.

Ed

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God listens. He may not always give you everything you want, when you want it; but he always gives you what you really need, when you need it most!
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 12:33 pm 
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Hi Ed,

Same name, but that wasn't me over there ;)

I will read through that topic first as it may answer my questions. Thnx for pointing it out :)

Joost

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Video's of my Pt. Altum, Pt. sp. Santa Isabel and Pt. Sp. Rio Nanay:
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_q ... type=&aq=f


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 1:03 pm 
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Hi Joost,

If you want to get a good idea about how your biotope should look like and which fishes occur there, then you should have a look at this video, we have mentioned this on threads before. It is in German, but as you come from the Netherlands I am sure this will not be a problem for you. At the start of the video there is an ad for a video about African cichlids, but if you just wait for a few minutes then you will see the full video.

http://www.aquanet.tv/Video/198-im-revi ... -venezuela

Kind regards,

Dirk

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 1:18 pm 
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Thnx Dirk
This the video that I have been using all the time while I was building the tank background!

I have and have had different species of angels, but don't have experience with the other fish that live in the Altum biotope as also can be seen in the various different nature underwater video's. I would like the tank to have a serene atmosphere like in my last show tank. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GRm3oLL ... ata_player

This tank is much bigger than my last show tank, but still nothing compared to nature. That is why I am seeking advice from people who have experience with keeping some of he other fish from the same biotope with Altum. Just to be reasonably sure that I am not going to end up with a variety of fish that drive the Altums nuts :)

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Video's of my Pt. Altum, Pt. sp. Santa Isabel and Pt. Sp. Rio Nanay:
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_q ... type=&aq=f


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 2:21 pm 
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Though Ged's pics don't focus on his ornamentation but rather on his beautiful altum, the little you can see of his setup shows what for me is ideal as to altum tank decoration to simulate the habitat as close as possible.

http://www.finarama.com/forum/viewtopic ... 4095#24095

I would only use a slightly finer sand and throw in some leaves from a tropical arbor such as catappa or similar, this to stain the water a bit and to have a bit of leaf litter whirling around the bottom.

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 04, 2011 11:41 pm 
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Thnx again Ed!

I have made a background that looks like granite. Painted different shades of grey, but it still needs the final layer of epoxy raisin. In the last layer I will be throwing Laterite (hope that this is how you spell it) to get the same color as in the aquanet video, and also to be rid of the shine of the epoxy.

I have read through the topic that you pointed out. So far I like: Pt. Altum :) , I already own a P. Gibbiceps that would love the size of my new tank, so I am happy to see that he is listed, M. Ramirezi, the black and Yellow Leporinus sp. , Geophagus Juripari, corydorad concolor.

I just don't know how this would behave together in one tank.

It is too bad that the Simulans tetra's do appeal so much to the appetite of the Altums, I love the looks of a large shoal of these :)

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Video's of my Pt. Altum, Pt. sp. Santa Isabel and Pt. Sp. Rio Nanay:
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_q ... type=&aq=f


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 10:03 am 
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Laterite I believe is a rich reddish clay, I would suggest a fine lighter off white to medium gray granite chip if you rant to go real Orinoco. What gives the reddish color is the tone of the tannins in the water, but the stonres and rocks of the river are from white to dark gray, the sand is mostly white, sometimes a light beige.

Just looked up this product.

http://www.adgshop.com/PhotoGallery.asp ... de=104-072

I really don't like the way it looks for the sand bottom, but it should work to cover the rock faces, or a similar color.

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God listens. He may not always give you everything you want, when you want it; but he always gives you what you really need, when you need it most!
E.R.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 12:02 pm 
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Hi Joost,

Glad to hear that you were already working from the video.

One tip that I would like to give you, is that you should make quite sure that you can scrub your background with a hard brush so that you can keep it clean, so remember to put enough layers of epoxy on those colors. This will be very important for future maintenance.

Kind regards,

Dirk

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PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:16 pm 
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This is the tank that I am building:

Image

Since there is no water and lights in the tank yet it is hard to take good photos. Here is the background already cemented and half painted.
Image

Image

And this is the color that I should end up with somehow:
Image

I have finished the whole painting job. All rocks are different shades of grey. All cracks are black. Some parts of the bakcground have been left totally flat, and painted black, to hopefully create more illusion of depth.
There are already two thick layers of Epoxy raisin on it.

I would like to put white/yellowish sand on the bottom. In the third layer of expoxy near the bottom I will put the same sand of it to get a more natural border between bottom and background.

I want to make blackwater in the tank, but still I don't think that that will make the background as red/brownish as in the Aquanet video. That is why I came up with the laterite idea, as it is advertised as being pretty much the same as what is in the soil around the south american rivers. The color matches pretty good as well. I was planning on making patches on the background with more of it, and with less of it. So that the grey is visible though it still.

I have never seen the product that you are linking to in Holland Ed. Do you think it is fine enough to put in the epoxy?

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Video's of my Pt. Altum, Pt. sp. Santa Isabel and Pt. Sp. Rio Nanay:
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_q ... type=&aq=f


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 05, 2011 2:19 pm 
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Somehow the photos are not fully displayed. What did I do wrong?

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Video's of my Pt. Altum, Pt. sp. Santa Isabel and Pt. Sp. Rio Nanay:
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_q ... type=&aq=f


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