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 Post subject: Darkened discus
PostPosted: Sun Mar 26, 2017 3:27 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2008 12:13 pm
Posts: 12
Location: Sweden
Hi,

I got 8 Altums 2 weeks ago and things are not going exactly great.

I've noticed one were a bit skinny and has lately become very darkened. I treated for nematodes last week as he was skinny but very aggresive, and ate a lot. I filmed him and he looks really bad, he almost looks like he's blind, bumping in to stuff, the correct thing is probably to euthanize him. But i need to do something as other fish is showing stress symptoms. I noticed in the video that it looks like the forehead has holes or marks, could it be Hexamita/Flagellates?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qHI_aRdrbsA

All fish still eats except this one, he poops "firm dark sausages", and not anything remotely white or yellow. So i have not suspected Flagellates or bacteria, but seeing the video im not sure anymore.

This last weekend all fish has been frightened with my presence, they have always been a bit careful before as it's only been two weeks - but only careful, not frightened.

Water values:
No2: 0
No3: 20-30ppm (i can't do anything about this as that's the value from my tap)
PH: 7 (The fish was quarantined/acclimatized for 6 weeks before i got them in PH7 with no problems what so ever.)

40-50% WC every day for the last two weeks.

Could it be ammonia poisoning? Unfortunately I dont have an ammonia test kit.


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 Post subject: Re: Darkened discus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 5:41 am 
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Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2008 12:13 pm
Posts: 12
Location: Sweden
I have no idea why i wrote Darkened Discus as the subject, i obviously mean Altum :?


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 Post subject: Re: Darkened discus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 6:39 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 11:27 am
Posts: 10
Location: Aarhus, Denmark, Europe
How does the left eye look ? It might just be the camera angle or is it a bit big ?

I once had a fish with an eye scratch from the net/transportation. It disappeared with no treatment other than regular water changes.

What temperature do you keep them at ? I keep mine at 30 celsius.

You could try to increase the temperature to 32 degrees for a few weeks.

Thats a lot of water changes, should be great water. When I change water once a week my Altums get very stressed.

Perhaps you could dim the light in the tank a bit to lower the stress level?


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 Post subject: Re: Darkened discus
PostPosted: Mon Mar 27, 2017 7:12 am 
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Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2008 12:13 pm
Posts: 12
Location: Sweden
JanBaslev wrote:
How does the left eye look ? It might just be the camera angle or is it a bit big ?

I once had a fish with an eye scratch from the net/transportation. It disappeared with no treatment other than regular water changes.

What temperature do you keep them at ? I keep mine at 30 celsius.

You could try to increase the temperature to 32 degrees for a few weeks.

Thats a lot of water changes, should be great water. When I change water once a week my Altums get very stressed.

Perhaps you could dim the light in the tank a bit to lower the stress level?


Hello and thanks for the reply.

All the Altum are unfortunately stunted in growth and thus the big eye. Most of them were pretty thin on arrival but they've fattened up pretty good since i got my hands on them (except this one).

I keep them at 30 celsius, i lowered the temperature to 27 degrees last night in case it's problem with oxygen. I'm currently at work so i haven't been able to evalute if it was for better or worse. If it's for the worse i will slowly raise it to 32 tonight/tomorrow.

You may be on to something with the light. It has been very sunny outside these last days which seems to stress them, they instantly hide when i'm close during daylight. During the evening when it's only the ramp that lights up the tank they are usully much more calm and ignore me. I just realized i previously had curtains on a window near this specific tank with an older set of Altum which blocked the direct sunlight. I will definitely add them back when i get home.

That said; i still feel there's more too it than stress? The fish has gone almost blind, and that can't be due to stress? But there are no physical clues except fins and body is very very dark, fins are almost purpleish red. No clamped fins, no wierd poop, no heavy breeding, very aggresive (untill it got partially blind), it did hide a bit though, and i have noted some yawns.


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 Post subject: Re: Darkened discus
PostPosted: Fri Mar 31, 2017 7:58 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 11:27 am
Posts: 10
Location: Aarhus, Denmark, Europe
How is is going with that Altum?

I think yawning is quite normal for Altum - not sure why they do it, but several of mine does it too.


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 Post subject: Re: Darkened discus
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 4:12 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2008 12:13 pm
Posts: 12
Location: Sweden
JanBaslev wrote:
How is is going with that Altum?

I think yawning is quite normal for Altum - not sure why they do it, but several of mine does it too.


I had to euthanize two as they were completely blind, even though the eyes looked "healthy" as you saw in the video i posted. In the end i medicated both with praziquantel and metro. After the metro treatment things got better. There were no white feces like i said but the treatment worked.

The reamining 6 are now happy and are doing great. I took this video right after a water change today, that's why they look a bit pale in color. Also quite a bit of brown algae growth has taken place which i much more prefer to shiny glass :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ID-sFKGVQaY


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 Post subject: Re: Darkened discus
PostPosted: Sun Apr 23, 2017 6:49 pm 
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Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2005 3:21 am
Posts: 4224
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
Hi Twitch, sorry for not seeing this post earlier. Very nice altum you have here. What are your water parameters? And what are you feeding them?

As to those you had bumping into things, you did the appropriate thing. Some parasites eventually make their way to the optic nerve and then the brain, killing the fish. This was a frequent ailment when I first started keeping altum and it also happened with wild discus, Uaru fernandezyepezi and Mesonauta sp. Maybe the discus not that often.

After I started deworming/deparasiting wild cichlids upon arrival in my tanks, I eventually got rid of that problem in particular.

Ed

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God listens. He may not always give you everything you want, when you want it; but he always gives you what you really need, when you need it most!
E.R.


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