DNA database for FINARAMA ?

#1
Hi friends,

times are go by far and not only in North America will be possibility to make DNA codes with fishes. Too much from you can be make it in somewhere institut in next near times now. I have one thought, why we don´t make our own DNA databaze of Pterophyllum?
Yesterday called me my friend from Veterinary University in Brno and said me, that near by University in Zoological institut they have be all for decoding DNA in this year. It opening any possibility also for us, but my friend who are profesor there have good knowns in this institut and he said me that I have be all door opening.
Dave wrote here, that in US and Canada it possible for any few dollars.
...and what we need more? I think that only little piece from fin we can be take without any harm by they or if any poor fish will be die. It´s opening new possibility for too much questions for us.
I have approach to several populations of wild fishes, who were came to CR in several few years from Amazonia (it´s too damage, that I don´t know perfect from what places they came) - so three wild types scalare, Manacapuru, Peru altum, one line of fourstriped who came from nature before twenty years and never by crossing, too much all from breeder´s forms. From altums (imports and Linke´s line) and one type leopoldis from any (?) place in Brazilia.

Yes, I know that this is run on long way also, but it can be helping us moving further opening any from secrets for us? :)
What your opinions, please?

Jan
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re: DNA database for FINARAMA ?

#3
thanks to the timely reminder, Jan, I found your post again.

I'm starting to realize that this is an excellent science project for schools and I'm going to see if my kid's school would consider it. Imagine if a known species were sent in and it became split into 5 species ! They could get the school name in the latin binomial if the science-juggling powers-that-be were generous.

re: DNA database for FINARAMA ?

#5
maybe slightly more than a month...but it's gettin there : )

I noticed Izeni is working on the usefulness fo ba4rcoding to study the stingrays
Toffoli, D.*, T. Hrbek, M. L. G. de Araújo, M. P. de Almeida, P. Charvet-Almeida and I. P. Farias. 2007. A test of the utility of DNA barcoding in the radiation of the freshwater stingray genus Potamotrygon (Potamotrygonidae

Re: re: DNA database for FINARAMA ?

#8
rag wrote:Hey, that would be something great.

what specific investigative strengths do you feel this test has ?
if people actually knew how to dissect the testis out of their angelfish cadavers i think it would be better to do a rtPCR of mRNAS in the testis and do a RAPD of all the cDNAs made from the testis pool. my lab's studies on some testis-specific genes show that they rapidly evolve as opposed to generally-expressed genes in dipterans.

here's a short primer on RAPD analysis:

http://avery.rutgers.edu/WSSP/StudentSc ... /rapd.html

re: DNA database for FINARAMA ?

#11
I have a fish or two that have some deformed fins ( regrowth after disease or injury or degeneration ), that I was considering clipping them anyway in order to try for a better regrowth.

I'm pretty sure that even right now we can also still get some numbers of samples from the unlucky ones in the last of this season's imports.

re: DNA database for FINARAMA ?

#14
Hi,

just a fast warning for DNA-samples: If you are not 100% sure of the exact location of collecting (ir from imports you will hardly ever know), there is no (or extreme little) use of doing DNAs. It has shown errors with many misleading locations in many species and therefore made the understanding of the species (separation) even wors, than improved it.

Also remember in the upper Orinoco live at least 3 very different P. altum populations (very different) and in the Rio Negro at least 4 complete different angelfish forms (shown in DISCUSBOOK01 - all of it).

Best regards from one who collects,

Heiko Bleher
www.aquapress-bleher.com

Re: re: DNA database for FINARAMA ?

#15
Heiko Bleher wrote:Hi,

just a fast warning for DNA-samples: If you are not 100% sure of the exact location of collecting (ir from imports you will hardly ever know), there is no (or extreme little) use of doing DNAs. It has shown errors with many misleading locations in many species and therefore made the understanding of the species (separation) even wors, than improved it.

Also remember in the upper Orinoco live at least 3 very different P. altum populations (very different) and in the Rio Negro at least 4 complete different angelfish forms (shown in DISCUSBOOK01 - all of it).

Best regards from one who collects,

Heiko Bleher
www.aquapress-bleher.com
Hello Heiko,

Could these 3 different P. altum populations you mentioned explain why there are variations to how altums appear in the trade and on finarama?

If you have experienced collecting all three, could you kindly describe the differences you see between the 3 phenotypically?

Best,

Dennis
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